Speaker 1 (00:00:06) - Recorded live from the back of the Mystery Machine. It's the Photo Happy Hour podcast. Hey, and welcome, everybody. Come on in and grab a seat at the bar. I'm your photo happy hour. Bartender Michael Mowbray. Joining me behind the bar are Dan Frievalt and Carl Caylor. Hey, guys. Hey, what's up?

Speaker 2 (00:00:33) - This is.

Speaker 1 (00:00:34) - This is late night with the happy hour, guys, because later here, freaking late. Yeah, it's later for you than it is here. It's sort of like a wormhole between here and Michigan because it's like it's. It's only like 9:00 here.

Speaker 2 (00:00:49) - What? Ten?

Speaker 1 (00:00:51) - That's crazy. How does that even work? I don't get that. You know, other people at different time.

Speaker 2 (00:00:58) - It's better here because everybody is on Easter time here. When I was in our mountain, we were only 20 minutes away from Eastern Time zone. And so everybody that called in, I have to say it, 9:00 here right now. What time is it where you're from? Because they didn't get most people didn't grasp the concept of Eastern and Central Time, even though they lived on the border.

Speaker 2 (00:01:20) - So you say, hey, it's 9:00 right now. Is it 10:00 at your place? Just keep that in mind when you come in for your appointment next Monday. Yeah. Or running out.

Speaker 1 (00:01:30) - All the time.

Speaker 2 (00:01:31) - When we photographed out at the Ghost Town Inn in Vegas, and it's like one side of the street, it was, you know, Arizona time. And the other side of the street was, you know, Nevada time incessantly. Your phone kept switching like, wait a minute, what time? And now it's this, though. It's a it's a ghost town. That's why it's a good style. Spooky.

Speaker 1 (00:01:52) - Speaking of spooky. Our topic this week is I assisted programs, how I can help photographers. I don't know if we're going to get into how I can hurt photographers. That could be a whole nother show.

Speaker 2 (00:02:05) - But so we could have like a theme song from like six Mr. Bottle. Oh, yeah, That's where the drink. Hold on a minute. No.

Speaker 1 (00:02:15) - No, I mean, that's.

Speaker 1 (00:02:16) - That's when I. When sticks lost me when they came out with Domo arigato, Mr. Roboto. I'm like, what the f is this?

Speaker 2 (00:02:24) - You only come on now, though. But everyone loves the pudding. You can't have your pudding. Like, Come on. I don't get that. Come on, Floyd, let. Yeah. Come on, Pink Floyd. I don't get that. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:02:38) - So never pudding. If you don't eat your meat, how can you have dessert if you don't have the main course? I mean, you need to have rules. That's what they're saying.

Speaker 2 (00:02:50) - Yeah. And he finds. I guess it sits.

Speaker 1 (00:02:53) - Before the worms ate in the brain. Don't get me going on Pink Floyd lyrics. Anyway, back to I.

Speaker 2 (00:02:59) - Yeah. Hi. Hey. We could use AI to create new Pink Floyd lyrics and mesh it with Mr. Roboto and Styx lyrics. Yeah, we could make our own hit song. Oh, I'm totally doing that tomorrow.

Speaker 1 (00:03:14) - Yeah, yeah. My schedule and would clear tomorrow.

Speaker 2 (00:03:17) - And then I'm going to make a new background out of it. I mean, that's what Mark Lane did. He used I think was it I think it was Pink Floyd that he he quoted one of the song lyrics and that's what his background where I background. Oh, really? Yeah, I think you're right. That's pretty darn cool.

Speaker 1 (00:03:32) - That's crazy crazy stuff. Yeah. Actually I was doing playing around with I there quite a bit like midjourney and stuff for a while and I kind of backed off it because I was having fun with it. But I started to, you know, I was posting, people liked it and then everybody came out so anti I though I'm like, Yeah, you know, I'm going to back off of this stuff for a while, but we're not talking about that. We're talking about things like, I don't know, generative fill in the new beta version of Photoshop, which I think we've all played with. Yes. Degenerative hill.

Speaker 2 (00:04:07) - Degeneration.

Speaker 1 (00:04:08) - Yeah, that's mostly what I've had because I hadn't had a lot of luck with it, but a little.

Speaker 2 (00:04:12) - Well, it's like when Content-aware Fill first came out, it was kind of like rolling the dice. Like you never quite sure what you're going to get, you know? But it said when it worked, it was great. And similar to generative fill, it's like, man, like when I'm what you need to add to canvas because I like to have the canvas stretch around the frame. You know, I would do content aware or like stretching it and different things. Well, yeah, that gender fill is worked pretty awesome. Works great.

Speaker 1 (00:04:46) - For that. I have done that landscape photos or stuff with landscape or nature in the background does a good job of. However, on a different job I had I had a if a client where I've done some fine art black and whites of some farm animals don't don't ask why. Anyway, client was holding the supposed piglet that was a little old for a piglet, so he had to hang on to it so I could actually get a photo of it. So I was trying to get rid of his hands like his gloved hands, and then fill in because I need a little bit more of the of the pig beyond like its chest.

Speaker 1 (00:05:19) - So I need a little bit more. I need a little bit more pig there, dudes. I got I got a I got a pig in a bucket. I got a pig wearing boots. I got a pig wearing gloves. I like get rid of the gloves. I got rid of the gloves and then put the gloves on the pig. So, yeah, it was a mess. I ended up doing it myself.

Speaker 2 (00:05:46) - That reminds me, I kind of forgot about this, but I was doing a training several months back on it in my insiders group and we were creating digital backgrounds and then I was creating that in Leonardo and then, which is like Midjourney and bringing it into Photoshop. And then all let's add different elements. So I wanted to add like a little mouse in the corner to give it like a little spooky feel. So I, you know, selected it and generative fill came up and I said, you know, add a mouse. So what comes up is, you know, so a computer mouse and, you know, it gives you three versions.

Speaker 2 (00:06:27) - So I clicked on. Red one blue one a white one. I think, Oh, my gosh. I guess I have to put, you know, hey, like they say, be more district descriptive. But yeah, maybe I need to put a rodent with dark hair and a long tail, you know, or something. But yeah, just don't put most of this. Oh, I was doing some beach photos and I added they had one seagull flew by in a pretty decent spot. I had to move it over just a little bit, but I thought, you know, if you noticed, if there was three seagulls, you know, in this area, it carried a little more depth and everything. And so I circled the area and said, Add more birds. There is a robin in a balloon.

Speaker 1 (00:07:14) - But what she should have done is just she she she should have said had a flock of seagulls like.

Speaker 2 (00:07:21) - A guy with a big back making me say, Yeah, album cover comes up.

Speaker 2 (00:07:28) - They had I on done I had a flock of.

Speaker 1 (00:07:32) - Seagulls to the portrait.

Speaker 2 (00:07:34) - I guess I'm going to try.

Speaker 1 (00:07:38) - That now actually.

Speaker 2 (00:07:38) - I wonder what it would do now. Take off my Van Halen shirt before you jinx abandoned. They break up. It's like. Hey, tell people what we do. What we're doing here.

Speaker 1 (00:07:52) - What are we doing here?

Speaker 2 (00:07:54) - We're talking with topic, but we didn't. For those that are new. They don't know what we're what we're doing. Nah, screw those guys. They chewed off already. They're not.

Speaker 1 (00:08:05) - If they're already listening to Smart Lis or Joe Rogan or somebody.

Speaker 2 (00:08:10) - And if you say they, you're really. You're very being generous. That's right.

Speaker 1 (00:08:19) - He she is moving on already.

Speaker 2 (00:08:21) - Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:08:22) - Anyway, yeah, this is a podcast for professional photographers friends a long time. Well, we get together, we drink and we talk crap. Okay. Anyway, our top.

Speaker 2 (00:08:31) - Ten movie quotes we have to drink. So.

Speaker 1 (00:08:33) - Yes, Yes.

Speaker 2 (00:08:34) - And drink lyrics.

Speaker 2 (00:08:35) - The songs just like the seagulls.

Speaker 1 (00:08:37) - Good.

Speaker 2 (00:08:38) - So lots of drinks. Yes.

Speaker 1 (00:08:39) - So one bit of AI we've all been using and been, I think pretty happy with is something called Voto Z. Voto Right. Evernote vote. I think.

Speaker 2 (00:08:49) - It's a vato don't I don't got this it's if that's the wrong thing to say.

Speaker 1 (00:08:56) - Though.

Speaker 2 (00:08:57) - I always say you vote too. But I heard other people say vato.

Speaker 1 (00:09:01) - So people say Godox too. And it's godox.

Speaker 2 (00:09:03) - So yeah you photo or vato however.

Speaker 1 (00:09:07) - So it's a retouching eye that you know there's been just been retouching eye out for a while. I've had. And also called Photo Pro, something like that. I've had that for a while and use it from time to time or bits and pieces of it. But this is the first thing I've run across. Where. You could take a regular headshot or whatever into it and. Click. Oh. A couple of tweaks done. Pretty much gets you there.

Speaker 2 (00:09:35) - Well, and not only that. I mean.

Speaker 2 (00:09:39) - I've been using the for sessions where I used to not retouch. You know, we always preach for years, don't waste time retouching every image before the sales presentation because you're you're wasting time. You're spending time on images that they may not purchase. So retouch a few of them so they get the idea and then whatever they purchase, you go back and retouch. Well, with Ivanhoe, since it's so easy, I've been retouching everything because you could just basically set a preset and click all your images and say, Woohoo, and they're all retouched. No, I want to clarify.

Speaker 1 (00:10:16) - It's not voice activated, so you don't say woop, you actually have to click Oh minus.

Speaker 2 (00:10:21) - Yeah. Oh really? I program well, yeah. The dictate thing, you know. Yeah, yeah. It's like it's like, you know, Siri, when I say order Starbucks, it just woop.

Speaker 1 (00:10:32) - Because.

Speaker 2 (00:10:33) - You know, it's done. You have a all sudden you have a star named after you. Is that how it is? Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:10:37) - Yeah. It it. But yeah, you know, you click and go and you can retouch a ton of images all at once. So I've been. Changing my thought process, you know, always trying to evolve and use technology to, you know, always speed up our businesses and be more profitable. And and my order is, I have to say, I've been crazy over the top. And maybe it's coincidence. I mean, I also changed my my pricing and stuff as well to help. Boost people up. So I think it's a combination of both. But yeah, seeing those images blemish free, you know, and there's other softwares I would run. To give it like a I would say like a 75% kind of retouch, just an action or something. Portraiture, you know, I would run that sometimes on images just to soften them a little bit, but I would never that just would soften the image, which I never liked, right? You know, because then it just looks like plastic.

Speaker 2 (00:11:42) - I want to go in and find it, you know, take the blemishes off. And that's what I like about Erato, is it? It's actually removing blemishes. I'm not even doing any skin softening, you know, but it's whitens the teeth, it brightens the eyes, it removes blemishes. And then you can do burn and dodge, remove neck wrinkles, double chins, double chins, forehead wrinkles that it can tell if if a particular senior has a more of a forehead wrinkle. You add that and then you add it to all the images you know, you know, or a.

Speaker 1 (00:12:14) - Shine or a.

Speaker 2 (00:12:15) - Greasy I yeah, yeah. Love skin really got it all in his skin. Life saver. Yeah. You know, I walked around. I still have it in my camera bag. The little oil sheets, makeup, oil. And it's like just the other day. I mean, even though I'm using the mojo, I noticed the girl was getting shiny. Towards the end of the session.

Speaker 2 (00:12:34) - I said, Here, I pulled the sheets out. She didn't know what it was. I'm like, Hit it here, you know, at your hot spots. And she's like, Oh my gosh, that she was all, you know, greasy. She's like, That's disgusting. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:12:46) - Well, it doesn't take much on those sheets. Yeah, it.

Speaker 2 (00:12:49) - Doesn't. That's what I told her, you know. And but yeah, especially, you know, using flash, even though it's just a little pop of flash that it's more specular. So it's going to hit those highlights and those oily hot points in the face. But yeah, now it's just a slider and it takes, takes set right away. I mean, it's pretty amazing. What I like about it is that even for I did a headshot for a law office and the guy was like stubbly, stubbly, non shaven, you know. And he had somewhat, you know, adult acne, but acne nonetheless. And it got rid of it around all this double.

Speaker 2 (00:13:33) - So this double stayed. Wow. And yeah. And it took the color out and I thought this this is cool. And that's a lifesaver.

Speaker 1 (00:13:44) - And they keep they keep evolving it to I mean, I just downloaded an upgrade, I think, yesterday where Dan, you and I had talked about this is like we wish they had like keyboard shortcuts or they add some keyboard shortcuts in now.

Speaker 2 (00:13:57) - So I sent her a message saying, Yeah, you need to add some keyboard shortcuts because just even clicking. Yeah. From. From the from the color to the to the retouching am I hit our for retouching you know hit right I said see for color but I'm like no sees for crop so I said but see for crop but um. I think our I think our for retouching. Yeah I was giving them a bunch of suggestions but yeah she's like oh I'll pass that on. They seem very receptive to two ideas. I think my opinion is I think they came out with it. I think it was geared more almost towards amateurs.

Speaker 2 (00:14:39) - But now that a bunch of professionals are using it, they're really hitting up more professionals to promote it. For one and for two, they're listening to what we have to say.

Speaker 1 (00:14:49) - And because we're going to give them huge volume, because how they work is you purchase credits. So it's not like a software you buy or even a subscription. You have you actually purchase credits for however many, you know, retouching you're going to do a month or how many images you're going to be touching a year or whatever. And you you buy credits for that. So yeah, we're going to have a heck of a lot more images to retouch than the typical amateur. So yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:15:19) - And I think you do need to have internet service to do it. Yeah. So it's like the Photoshop beta version and or any of the AI streaming type of things because it's drawing from all over, all over the place so well. And that's another suggestion I gave them though is that you that there should be a way to run it.

Speaker 2 (00:15:40) - If you don't have internet, you maybe just can't export, but you could. There should be a way to write, to edit. And then when you get to an Internet, so for instance, like I were. On location sometimes where I don't have internet. So I went through like my hotspot on my phone. But even the place we were camping, I the phone didn't work well. I had to go to a place that had Internet, you know, like and in order to edit. And so I would like to see where I could edit everything. But then I get the idea because it has to be linked up to the internet to to link up with your credits when you export. But I would just love to. I don't care. I can export when I get home, right? If I can sit at my camper and I can edit a bunch of stuff and then after the end of the weekend I get home, then I export it, That's totally fine, you know, Or when I get to a place where there's Internet, okay, boom, export, then go back.

Speaker 2 (00:16:47) - You know, that would be a time saver. And that's kind of how Photoshop works works as well. Like you don't have to be 100% online, but you have to be at least, what, like once a month have an Internet connection or something like that so we can communicate. I think it's actually drawing from it in real time, from my understanding. But I could be wrong. No, because I can use Photoshop without Internet. All right. But I mean, the the I generated part of it.

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Speaker 2 (00:18:53) - Oh, I even used. That's a good point. You know, I would.

Speaker 1 (00:18:56) - Have to be.

Speaker 2 (00:18:57) - Yeah. I've yet to use the I. Offline. Yeah, because that's searching their database of imagery. That's a good point. But just retouching. You can use Photoshop or color, you know, you can do everything else. Photoshop wise. Yeah. Oh, absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So. Now. Now, I just pulled up. I want to see if they. I didn't update though if they did like the speed keys now.

Speaker 2 (00:19:27) - When did you have to listen? I got to update again.

Speaker 1 (00:19:29) - I updated yesterday morning was the day before I had a had like about a dozen corporate headshots that and again for folks at home that doesn't corporate headshots I did in less than ten minutes. So yeah. And that was even that was even doing background extractions because I shot them all high key and on location. So I use a 60 inch softbox as my background is my high key background. Well, you get some people are a little shorter or a little taller and you get a little edge of the of the softbox in there, which doesn't bother me because you know, it's an easy retouch. Well, now I can just just go on to your photo and say, you know, white background and just done.

Speaker 2 (00:20:15) - Yeah. Well and yeah. And then I come in. We're jumping around but yeah. With. Generative filling in Photoshop. There, I I'm changing the way I shoot a little bit even because there is there's a place I photograph.

Speaker 2 (00:20:35) - I like to use windows as reflections and things, but sometimes a softbox or myself is in the reflection. So I have to be creative with the way I position myself and or position the light. And sometimes the light isn't really where I want it. Well, now I don't care. Like there's an image I'm looking at right now. The softbox was in the reflection, but I just select it and sit generated fill it, takes the softbox out and replaces it with a natural. Whatever's you know would be there in the window like a plant or whatever. It's it's pretty awesome. Or there's another place that I love the photograph. It's a doorway. And a couple of years ago. The it's a cool old doorway with a dress or a wooden door. Super cool. But they they did something in the basement of the restaurant where they had to put an exhaust through. So they drilled a hole and they had this silver, you know, pipe coming out. Not even pipe. It's the. The Hvac.

Speaker 2 (00:21:42) - Right. Right. Yes, sir. Thing. And it's, you know, it's it's a pretty good size. And that's right in the doorway now. So I'd always I'd have to keep going in there and, you know, I need it for every shot, you know. And everyone bought those images because they were so cool. But I have to go in and remove that now. It's awesome. I'm just selecting it. It generated fill and it's filling it in. It's cool. I mean, for a while I thought, could I just bring, like, a little wooden box or something and just set it over for the shoot? It would kind of blend in with the wooden door and be like, you know, try and get creative where I don't have to Photoshop it. Like, Don't you love that when you said Do weddings? And someone's like, Oh, just Photoshop? And it's like, Yeah, that's the groom's boon there. That's crooked. And he's in every shot. I'm not going to go in and turn his, his flower on, you know, 100 images, but it's only in the ones that the grooms are in.

Speaker 2 (00:22:37) - Yeah, right, exactly. Oh yeah. So. So, yeah. So I guess you can be a little lazy or it's help, you know, with some of that stuff. And I think it's. Think it's it's making our life easy and hopefully, you know, making us look. More professional. I mean, you can look at the downside is it's a lot easier for someone. Yeah. Yeah. To look professional. But same thing with digital cameras. Same thing with everything. So you have to stand out. You have to do more than you know. Kids can do it all. Awfully cool shot with their phone. Yes, indeed. So what about the experience? What things can you do that enter to your your business model as well? Well, and we're.

Speaker 1 (00:23:29) - Three photographers who get it right. A camera, too. And, you know. I doesn't necessarily like you, Votto doesn't necessarily fix shitty photography.

Speaker 2 (00:23:40) - No.

Speaker 1 (00:23:41) - So good. You know, we're all starting with really high quality images that were, you know, maybe have some blemishes or whatnot on it and like run through a bottle and boom, done doesn't fix two stops underexposed out of focus.

Speaker 1 (00:23:56) - So. Or poorly composed.

Speaker 2 (00:23:59) - But, you know, and that's a that's a good point because just this just a couple of weeks ago, I had a senior that had to reschedule a few times because of weather. And she's like, I can't, I need to make this work. And sure enough. The minute she got out of hair and makeup, a downpour, the storm rolled and. And I'm like, it's just a small little thing. It'll pass away a downpour and like, everything was wet. But I'm like, now it'll be cool. We'll be kept dodging rain the whole day. And the mom was nervous, but she's like, You know what? I'm stressed only not because they don't trust you and just stressed because I wanted it, you know, It was her other daughter. Weather was beautiful. It was flawless, you know? So then she came in and she's she's like, See, this is why we pay you What? What we do. These images are unbelievable. She's like, if people only knew what you know, how I was feeling.

Speaker 2 (00:24:56) - Had to work. It's fine. It'll be fine, you know? And I'm like, you can't get like, the sky was awesome. So we did. I did a lot of, like, epic. Sky shots to with her. I'm like, I don't you're not going to no one else is going to get this. You have to look at the positive of that, you know? Right.

Speaker 1 (00:25:12) - Because you don't often get epic skies.

Speaker 2 (00:25:15) - No, especially.

Speaker 1 (00:25:16) - This year because you get out hazy.

Speaker 2 (00:25:18) - Hazy, hazy on.

Speaker 1 (00:25:20) - Canadian smoke, some great sunsets.

Speaker 2 (00:25:22) - But since we haven't been getting sunsets even, it's just been it's like everything settles here. All the smoke settles here in the evening for some reason. And we have been not getting sunsets at all. I mean, there's been 1 or 2 because of summer. That's because you're in the Eastern Time zone. So. Yeah, that's right. Oh, yeah. Always comes around again. This goes around. So I've been using what I'm trying to think of what other like AI tools like.

Speaker 2 (00:25:55) - There's a thing called Match Eye as a color grading app, which is pretty cool. I've been playing with that. Oh, yeah. And you can you can grab. So as you if you've listened to this podcast, you might know I'm a bit of a movie. Kind of guy. I love movies. I love. The storylines of the color grading of movies and how color tells a story, all that stuff. So you can. There's also websites where you can go and they have all different color grades of movies which a lot of filmmakers use. Two color grade their their their movies and their films. Well, for years I've been emulating. Those color grades in Photoshop to create actions, to create color tones. But it's it's kind of difficult to do with this AI software. You can just grab a screenshot. Of a movie. Or like I said, there's other websites you can go to where they've grabbed screenshots and created color bars that go with it and you load that in and then you can it will color grade that that image.

Speaker 2 (00:27:09) - And now it doesn't you know, it doesn't work for every image, which is right. Well, not every same thing. When you buy actions, you know, they're like, oh, look at what this does. And yeah, it really doesn't. It doesn't always work. But, you know, but it. It works pretty well and it's super easy, so it's easier to play with it than the old way of doing it, where I'd have to really go in and spend a lot of time. Getting the color. And now what I'm doing is I'm bringing those into Erato and creating Presets. So they're just like like, like droplets or presets in Lightroom where you just click instead of running action and then you get the the color grade on those images so you can color grade and retouch and have all that all all in one. Well, and that's something we talked about last week down and I talked about that. I will work on your raw file. Yeah. So you you could I mean, do everything at once right from there.

Speaker 2 (00:28:20) - You know, the conversion, your tweak with your exposure, you're for real exposure to this actual metadata, your contrast, your highlight levels, your shadow levels, your color correction, and then you can add your color grading to it and then you retouching and output boom, just and you can batch it then. So. Yeah. Same senior, same spot. Done. And that's kind of. So. So the downfall of only retouching a few images is I would grab a particular image and retouch it completely, add my color grading, give it my look, if you would. And then, you know, they may come in a week or two later to place the order, you know, And then, yeah, they love that image because I retouched it and everything then. But they picked the other images from that same scene. And so then I'm like, Oh, okay, I want to match them. Yeah, yeah. And then I'm like, Well, I don't remember because I used this color grade.

Speaker 2 (00:29:26) - I tweaked that. I use this action, I use I use color effects pro, you know, even though it's layered, I'm still kind of like, what did I do to get that color? Because, you know, I used.

Speaker 1 (00:29:38) - To have to like low code codes after the image, I did all that stuff and it's.

Speaker 2 (00:29:43) - Like.

Speaker 1 (00:29:43) - The color effects is like f x and then did this and I did this in Topaz and I did.

Speaker 2 (00:29:50) - Yeah. And I'm trying to save a preset, so I'm naming the preset in Topaz or and color effects the name of the student, you know, or whatever. So now it's nice again with a vato because I can just say, okay, here's everything in this scene. Yeah, I'm doing all the same preset and it's boom because for a while. I thought I was trying to figure out the workflow with it because I'm like, maybe I'll still do the same workflow because you get charged per usage, you get charged per credit like we talked about earlier.

Speaker 2 (00:30:21) - So if I'm bringing in 100 images and I'm exporting 100 images, I get charged.

Speaker 1 (00:30:28) - 100 credits.

Speaker 2 (00:30:29) - 100 exports, 100 credits. The good thing is it's only like six $0.07 a credit, so it's not that expensive. So out of those 100, they might order, you know, 40, 50, 60 images. So I'm still kind of paying for images of not using. But it's still it's what is it? It's five bucks like big deal. Yeah. Then to try and. Like do the color and capture one, then bring five images into a photo to do the retouching, then export those, then bring it all in. Then when they place the order, I have to bring the those 40, 50, 60 images back in a vital and match the color, export it back out again. It's like you know what that's going to take $5 is going Yeah that time is more important. Exactly. So I'm just bringing them all in and exporting it and. And the other beauty is if if I do need to make any tweaks, if I export, I can export the same image 100 times.

Speaker 2 (00:31:27) - I only get charged once for that export. So. But I haven't had to go back and export again. Well, I was wondering about that because I. I wasn't thinking. I forgot the other day. I forgot that it would do actually extract it if I want an extraction. So I did the retouching, exported it, and I'm like, I just wait for the next part, you know, that actually it probably it isn't. Then if I go back to do that, the go back extract extract.

Speaker 1 (00:31:59) - Lowers the file name didn't change and the location didn't change.

Speaker 2 (00:32:02) - And the location. Yeah. You have to make sure you're doing the same project. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:32:08) - That's actually side tangent on that. That's really important to if you want to be able to use, go back to it. You can't change where those files are. Yeah, because you've got them on your work drive and then when you're done you're going to move it off to something else. You can't take those and pull them back and have a vato find them.

Speaker 1 (00:32:26) - No, it's you got to have them in the same spot. So you know where I, I import everything into like an annual folder with everything based on dates and names and stuff like that. You got to do. You have to because it links into that.

Speaker 2 (00:32:42) - Yeah, but I mean it it will tell you the the string. What would that be called. The the hierarchy. So good you could go back and put it put. All you have to do is put it back where it was and then it will link it back up. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, in fact yeah. The other day. So my workflow is where I. I bring everything into originals folder. Then I call down the images in bridge and then those images I move to what I call an edited edit folder, and then that's the folder. I only bring those images into vato. Because I don't need. You could call in there as well. But bridge is so quick. Right. I just want to bring in what what I need.

Speaker 2 (00:33:35) - But the other day I forgot to move on. So there's a shoot. I didn't move him and brought him in. Well, then I was going to move them into the edit spoiler. I'm like, No, I can't do that because then they'll they're technically in a different place. So I just left them, you know, where they were. Yeah. But like I said, if I probably won't go back, but. I like it. Yeah, and I still do. So again, my workflow too, is. I get them out of Erato. Same thing. I would get them out of capture one or Lightroom and then do any high end composite work or whatever in Photoshop. So. Right. I'm still doing, you know, I'm still going in, you know, looking, especially if they order like a 20 by 30 or something. I'm going in and really looking close at the retouching, the pores, stray hairs, you know. Well, that's something we talked about before we got on.

Speaker 2 (00:34:33) - I don't think we talked about it since we started recording. You know, people have pointed out, well, this doesn't do Avatar doesn't do this, it doesn't do this. We don't do that. It's nothing is going to do everything right. Yeah. You know, I mean, there's certain tools, the right tools for the right parts of the jobs, and you still need Photoshop for a lot of enhancement that we're doing. We want to get things right in camera. We said that over and over again and have good composition, good balance, good lighting, a good foundation to things. But then he Votto is going to help with the imperfections that are just there that week, and they're not going to be there next week on that person. It's the it's the darkness. It's a part of the process that's just going to get sped up immensely. Right. Right. Artificial intelligence.

Speaker 1 (00:35:20) - But it doesn't give it a glass glare. It doesn't it doesn't get rid of stray hairs for the most part.

Speaker 1 (00:35:27) - That's one of the features I've asked him. Put a stray hair tool or something in there for hairs that come across the face of being so nice. Yeah, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:35:36) - Well, speaking of which, though. Well, yeah, first let me finish the thought and what Carl said, because, yes, we're like, AI is not going to replace humans, first of all. Not yet. Not in six months. Yeah. So we still have to do things on our own. But yeah, part two is the remove tool in Photoshop, which is also new with the generative fill. I've been using that for stray hairs across the face. Stray hairs outside of the head. But at once, especially across the face and across the eye. You. It's amazing. It does something different than, like, the healing brush does it? It's basically taking the generative fill aspect and the healing brush aspect and bringing it together so it as you go across that hair that goes across the eyeball, it's looking what's underneath.

Speaker 2 (00:36:28) - And it's it's filling that in and wow is that awesome for. Stray hairs across space because I'm always stressing like if you feel a hair from your face. Right, move it. Let me. I can't see it when I'm shooting.

Speaker 1 (00:36:43) - No, not at all. Especially outside. You can't.

Speaker 2 (00:36:46) - At all. Terrible. I girls with like the soft thin hair which.

Speaker 1 (00:36:50) - Is all of them.

Speaker 2 (00:36:52) - Oh yeah. And a little bit of a breeze. And you know, of course it's blonde or even. Or if it's dark, it doesn't matter. The color of the hair, It's. It shows up. They're always like when they order the large print and I zoom in like, Oh, that's terrible if you got take some work. Yeah. But yeah, that remove tool is been awesome.

Speaker 1 (00:37:13) - Side tangent on the wood. Any time that you've got like out of 100 images if one is a little soft that's the one the order for their, their portrait right. Especially you know now that we were all shooting Sony and the eye focus and things like that or just like you really have a soft one had one the other day I was like a headshot and yeah shush I'm 58 years old.

Speaker 2 (00:37:42) - Anyway.

Speaker 1 (00:37:45) - Had one and I was like, you know, I'm going to process it. I'm like, Oh, damn, It's just a little, little out of focus. Let's just call it that and better terminology. And I took it into Topaz. Sharpen Man, the AI behind the Topaz sharpen anymore. It's just killer. I mean, not noisy. No, not bad at all. And I had this had a project for a big headshot client of mine where they're at a conference where I couldn't be at. So they hired some other photographer to do headshots for like 80 some people and they were going to horrible. She said, Next time we'll just we'll just get you there. But the contact got a of me and she says, Can you fix these And so there yeah there were I think out of the 80s some there were 17 they were out of focus. And ran them through Ivanhoe. They clean them up, do background extractions. They're shot on dark gray background. They wanted them on white.

Speaker 1 (00:38:45) - That was hard. And then and then took those 17 and took him took him into Photoshop with Topaz and Bam. I mean some, some stuff was really blurry. And you would. Yeah, especially for a headshot. You wouldn't know. You wouldn't know that they were. They were out of focus, so. There are tools.

Speaker 2 (00:39:07) - And speaking of, you talked about a white background. That they wanted a background white background, I should say.

Speaker 1 (00:39:16) - That would have been handy to tell the photographer, but maybe anyway.

Speaker 2 (00:39:19) - Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I don't know if you guys have also played around with Photoshop. The I'm going to pull it up here. I've used Photoshop. I'm not going to say it right. I've heard of them for. Yeah. New role, new filters.

Speaker 1 (00:39:35) - Oh yeah I have. I have them for a while but yeah. Is that something in there?

Speaker 2 (00:39:40) - Yeah. So it's pretty. Those are pretty awesome. They've been in there for a while. I yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:39:46) - I, there's a number of different ones.

Speaker 2 (00:39:48) - There's a number of different ones. Yeah. And the one that I use for composites a lot is like where you can match the background. So when I see like I would spend a lot of time matching the color and the density because you'll see the one big dead giveaway beyond lighting in in composites is the color shift in different like the background might be more blue than than the subject is more warm. And when you first start doing composites that's it's a dead giveaway. So we match those color tones and yeah, and I would cheat a lot by doing a texture over the top, you know, a color overlay exactly like my little filter, black and white with the zero filter. It will, it will look at you can tell it like this layer, which is your person, your subject in this layer which is your background. And it will look at the two and it will change your subject to match that background. And it's pretty stinkin accurate. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:40:48) - Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:40:48) - I think I did see that. I haven't played with that though.

Speaker 2 (00:40:50) - Yeah, it's pretty. It's pretty awesome. This is pretty awesome. So that made me think of it when you said if they shot in a gray background and a white background, like the first thing I went in my head is not only the color of that starkness that, you know, there's a certain. Light that happens with a white background and things that wrap that no light doesn't wrap around. But you know what I'm saying. There's a different glow from that white background and a gray back where the gray is going to subtract the light and the white's going to reflect, reflect that. We're going to get.

Speaker 1 (00:41:22) - A little bit more on the edges, if any, you know, unless you get a lot of blowback and then you get.

Speaker 2 (00:41:29) - Why you should you get the glow. Yeah. Yeah. And felt like glow angelic glow. Yeah but yeah that's another type. So Photoshop is adding that kind of, you know, I would consider that almost like an eye type thing.

Speaker 2 (00:41:43) - I mean it's looking at it, it's almost like color grading. It's blending it for you, you know what I mean? AI is the buzzword, so it all depends on, you know, what you actually consider I what I is doing. But. Huh. So does that mean instead of everybody tell us, Well, can't you just Photoshop that? Pretty soon they're going to say, Can't you just say that? Can't I just do that for you? Yeah, just.

Speaker 1 (00:42:08) - Give that to your robot.

Speaker 2 (00:42:09) - Yeah. Yeah, that's the rebuttal.

Speaker 1 (00:42:12) - I'll give that to my robot manservant.

Speaker 2 (00:42:14) - Okay. Answer it. Yeah. And, you know, speaking of which, you know. There's still like, say we can't replace humans. There's still a great need for just outsourcing stuff. Like we've all been like you like Michael. You mentioned Carl, like we've been doing this a long time. We're pretty good at getting things good in camera. There's, you know, there's a lot of things that.

Speaker 2 (00:42:40) - Were there 90%. So this is going to help us even more. But, you know, there's also things like that we can just outsource like like album design retouching itself. Like if you don't know Photoshop, if you don't, it's not going to replace Photoshop yourself to learn it. But instead of learning it, just outsource it, you know, instead of spending time with extractions. I always said if if it takes more than a minute to do the extraction, you should be outsourcing it. Yeah. And using something that you use in a pro competition then. No. Yeah. Yeah. Well yes. Yeah. But your everyday work, you know, like for years I had employees. The beauty of software automation Vas companies that do this is that it's so inexpensive. I don't need an employee, especially being seasonal and employees not going to call in sick might if I outsource it. They have tons of employees. I know I'm going to get it back in 24 hours. Right? Or you're going to yell at them.

Speaker 2 (00:43:38) - Yeah. Which for? Yeah. And you build. You build it into a price because it's a couple bucks. It's not like I'm paying or, you know, my employee, you know, 15, 20 bucks an hour and I have to create work for them when there's not work or like, Oh, I have to do this so that they can do that. Like, you know, it was that stressful. So now it's like, Oh, I can just send this off, you know, or and I'll be back in a day. Like, you know, I can focus on something that only I can do if I can book another session, you know, or. Oh, here's another instance. I'm on a tangent. I'm on a roll now, so. Are redoing the steps at our seasonal our new camper. We're redoing the steps because the steps weren't done right? Yeah. Yeah. And so they should have had a five step singer. Instead, they put a four step stringer.

Speaker 2 (00:44:35) - So the first step is only like three inches. And then the next step is, you know, everything's correct. You know, you're which which is hard.

Speaker 1 (00:44:44) - If you're coming back to your camper after, you know, being at the fire.

Speaker 2 (00:44:48) - For a while. Sometimes. Yeah. Sometimes it's easier at the fire and there's, there's games and things. Yeah. Yeah. So we need those steps to be seven, eight inches, you know, not that I but I've following the code. Yeah. But consistent so. So you know me, the guy, I'm like, I can cut my own stringers, I can save money. You know, I'm going to I, you know, I'm going to figure this all out. And then I looked them like all the pre cut stringers. They're not that much more. No dug and they're done. Don't boil them up, because if it's going to take me, if I cut five stringers and, you know, I'm doing the math in my head, how long is it going to take me to cut five stringers? And I could mess a few up and, you know, I could cut a finger, which is then also a trip to the hospital.

Speaker 2 (00:45:39) - So how long is it going.

Speaker 1 (00:45:40) - To take you to cut seven stringers.

Speaker 2 (00:45:42) - Right? Yeah. How many Stringer is going to cut off a stringer? Could cut Stringer. Yeah. I'm like, you know, I could. That's it. Yeah. You know, So, yeah, doing the math, I'm just going to buy them and then I can, like, especially this time of year, I'm so busy, I can keep up with everything I have going on. And look, why am I going to be cutting stringers? I'm going to be like. Get my get my orders in. Go up and enjoy the cabin and. Put put the stuff together and spend the best leaders in all the people that are listening. The three of you. That two of you. Two are. The three of you are what singers are. Yes.

Speaker 1 (00:46:25) - That's the thing. Your stepsister one.

Speaker 2 (00:46:27) - Yeah. Yeah. It's the same thing.

Speaker 1 (00:46:30) - In the.

Speaker 2 (00:46:31) - The rise in the run and the zig zag thing and the zig zag.

Speaker 2 (00:46:34) - You think so? But yeah. So basically, yeah. Long story short, outsourcing, which I've stressed a lot on this show, it goes more than just your business. It goes into if you have to hire someone to cut your lawn, if that gives you more time to to drum up business or to catch up. So people aren't complaining because where is my stuff? You know, then then do it because you'd be better off. Like what's what's the dollar per hour. How does it how does it equate if it's going to take me five hours to do X? And it only cost me. You know, $40, then spend the 40 bucks and then spend that five hours working on your business.

Speaker 1 (00:47:20) - To make.

Speaker 2 (00:47:21) - More, better ROI. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:47:24) - One bit of AI that we haven't talked about and don't want to touch on real long is, you know, writing things and, you know, using OpenAI or ChatGPT. You know, I can write, I've written tons and tons and tons of stuff in my life and I'm implementing a new text program for Malate where I would have people sign up to be get text notifications.

Speaker 1 (00:47:50) - And like I was like sat down. I'm like, Oh, I got to write an email to, you know, entice people and tell them, you know, Hey, this is something that's coming up. This is a good thing. Why don't you sign up here, opt in, all that kind of stuff. And I started I started typing. I was like, why the hell am I trying to write this? ChatGPT. Please write again, just like a couple of sentences of please write a an email that's going to entice people to sign up for my text service and receive marketing and promotional offers. Well done. I looked at I was like, Damn, it was actually really good.

Speaker 2 (00:48:26) - Copy paste. Done. Done. Yeah. And like these. Yeah, yeah. All these, all these AI tools, they all have those sound effects built in, done, done, done.

Speaker 1 (00:48:43) - It's scary how fast it does stuff sometimes too.

Speaker 2 (00:48:46) - It is. It is extremely scary. Well, that's something we didn't mention yet is that, you know, you're talking about auto in other you know that some of the things that these AI programs are doing you don't wait for them it's instant.

Speaker 2 (00:49:05) - It's like you done with it. You save as you saved you export it, saving it to your place in your desktop. I mean it. You're not waiting that till tomorrow or for two hours or it's done right now. When you're watching it, do it in front of you. It's crazy cool. So yeah, it's a whole different world.

Speaker 1 (00:49:26) - To You're watching the robot do it in front of you, huh? What are you using over there? Violates rule number seven of robots. So, yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:49:39) - So along the same lines, I, I, I saw on TikTok where there's, there's AI influencers. So you can't tell the difference. Oh, yeah. Like, like the deep fake, all that. So there's these. There's these. Computer generated. Influencers and you don't know that they're fake and they're they're promoting products. They have millions of followers or, you know, because they're they're using AI to create the script, which is intentional to, you know, draw attention. They're using a fake person, the AI, to to tell that script.

Speaker 2 (00:50:21) - And everything's put together in a format that is. Super trendy. Super. Yeah. Perfect. Yeah. You know, it's like. It's like, you know, it's like the movies. You know, like Harry Potter is a rip off of Star Wars, you know? Right. You know. Kind of like there's a formula that is for success and. They're doing it. And so it's some, you know, some guy in the basement of his parents house and making millions of dollars off of coding, coding stuff. Yeah. And and the best part is if you if you are let's say let's say a big company buys into this I that I is never going to get. A drunk driving. They're never going to get arrested for anything like, you know. True. True.

Speaker 1 (00:51:18) - But they may try to kill John Connor. So that's.

Speaker 2 (00:51:22) - True. That's true. Huh? I'll be back. Get to the chopper.

Speaker 1 (00:51:31) - So I know. Photo Happy hour Sponsored by Seniors Unlocked Featuring robots, education, AI overlays, brushes, more robots, textures, and more for enhancing your photography.

Speaker 1 (00:51:43) - Learn more at stalker's unlock.com/john Connor and by Carl Keller's one on one and group mentoring. You can contact Carl through his website at photo images by Carl net and of course sponsored in part by Molly America's top rated robot Godox retailer. Visit Gomo lite.com.

Speaker 2 (00:52:05) - There. What did she say? Godox got nice.

Speaker 1 (00:52:10) - Did I say I want to slap people? I'm sorry. I've had. I've had one of those days. It's Godox that comes from Eugene, the owner of Godox who started it because the the symbol, the Chinese symbols for the company is is a god in an ox. It's a lot. It's why a lot of people think it's a literal god ox. And he says, no, it's go the go because we want to go godox.

Speaker 2 (00:52:36) - That's similar to.

Speaker 1 (00:52:38) - But we didn't realize the armour of God. His name is Eugene.

Speaker 2 (00:52:43) - Yeah, that's. That's what I took away from that story. Yeah. There you go. That is how the. How the. The Chevy Nova didn't sell really well in, like, Sweden or something like that because it was a Latin America.

Speaker 2 (00:52:54) - Yeah. Because it meant no go.

Speaker 1 (00:52:56) - It means literally means no go. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:52:58) - No go. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:53:01) - Oh yeah. There's all kind of stories like that should be.

Speaker 2 (00:53:03) - A question by the way, my first vehicle.

Speaker 1 (00:53:05) - So Nova was really to rust out. Of course it did.

Speaker 2 (00:53:09) - Oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:53:10) - Oh yes.

Speaker 2 (00:53:11) - Three and a tres three. I was gonna say it was a 303. Oh yeah. 303. Yeah. Straight six baby. Yeah. Yeah. That's pretty safe. Awesome. It came with a track. With a track.

Speaker 1 (00:53:22) - Please tell me that track was hung under the dash.

Speaker 2 (00:53:24) - Oh, absolutely. Yeah, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:53:29) - Yes. Wait, wait. Let me guess. The color. Was it gold?

Speaker 2 (00:53:33) - The interior. Nell was in gold. We did paint it out, trying to think of what it might have been. Green, maybe there weren't.

Speaker 1 (00:53:41) - Too many different colors.

Speaker 2 (00:53:42) - Was that or. Yeah, gold was. Gold was a prime color of no. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:53:47) - Yeah. Yes. Yeah. That's $100 more to get the gold. Oh yeah. And speaking before we close. I eight track technology was pretty amazing because you could, even though it was a tape, you could skip songs, right? Cassettes came out, you couldn't skip it. You had to fast forward. And I didn't know where you were. Right?

Speaker 1 (00:54:11) - Some of the advanced tape players you could towards the end. Yeah, actually, they'll find the game. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:54:16) - But any I think pretty much any track you you could pretty much skip and I don't know how why they took that technology away but then yeah the advanced ones you could skip songs and still you know kind of like, hey it's done. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:54:31) - And good chunk.

Speaker 2 (00:54:34) - Yes, yes. And then CDs came along and that was great. As you could skip or even records, you could count the groups. Yeah. Oh right. I said there was, there was a there was a step back in technology unless you got the cassette single.

Speaker 2 (00:54:49) - But we had we Walkman radios, remember that it would fit in and we could take it around. I mean, there was a benefit to the portability of it, that's for sure.

Speaker 1 (00:55:00) - Yeah, I could never afford a Sony Walkman, so I had like a knockoff. It was like a Toshiba step step guy. I think I called it Crackle.

Speaker 2 (00:55:10) - Yeah. Crackle. Yeah. And he said, Listen, that stupid audio-technica. These.

Speaker 1 (00:55:19) - These might be audio-technica. These are.

Speaker 2 (00:55:24) - My.

Speaker 1 (00:55:24) - Headphones are Audio-technica.

Speaker 2 (00:55:26) - Yeah, they're.

Speaker 1 (00:55:28) - They're actually pretty good.

Speaker 2 (00:55:30) - Wow. But the pirate trades there in the future.

Speaker 1 (00:55:35) - Well, I don't know, guys. I check it out. It could be good. It could be bad. It may kill you someday.

Speaker 2 (00:55:41) - Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:55:44) - Till next time.

Speaker 2 (00:55:46) - Cheers. Drink's gone. Last call.

Speaker 1 (00:55:49) - You've been listening to the photo Happy Hour podcast. Be sure to hit that subscribe button to not miss a single action packed episode and join our photo Happy Hour Facebook group where we'll post links to the stuff we all talk about.

Speaker 1 (00:56:02) - You can find my Mo lite gear online at Go Mo Light. That's Geo Mo Ligety. You can find the Facebook page under Mo Lights store. And I also run the Godox Flash help group on Facebook. You can find Dan senior unlocked website at seniors unlocked.com that's seniors with an s at the end unlocked.com and the Facebook group under seniors unlocked and you can find Carl's coaching corner at CC photo coach CC photo coach.com till next time cheers to you.

Speaker UU (00:56:51) - I don't know who. Wah!

Speaker 3 (00:56:53) - I don't know what you want. If you want me to pay you to subscribe. I can tell you I don't have money, but what I do have are a very particular set of skills. Skills I have acquired over a very long career. Skills that make me a nightmare for people like you. If you subscribe now, that will be the end of it. I will not look for you. I will not pursue you. But if you don't, I will look for you. I will find you and I will annoy you.